Will there be a kit flow paper in the upcoming CDNLive in September?

Discussion in 'Cadence' started by Brenda Peters, Jun 25, 2007.

  1. I haven't been to the users groups in a while but I loved the yearly flow
    papers that Cadence flow teams used to give each year detailing their
    progress building chips and kits and flows and methodologies for us.

    These flows are when Cadence documents how they build a chip using their
    tools and then tapes out that chip and tests it to ensure it works, just
    like we do every day. Some of the future topics I see are documentation on
    building the PDK and on mixing analog and rf with digital on a single chip
    in different processes. They were on OpenAccess 2.0 years ago in the paper
    that I read but I'm sure they're on the latest OA by now.

    The great thing in the last paper I watched was when they stood there and
    unabashadly said they filed thousands of change requests each time they
    built a chip as their goal wasn't the chip per se but the software working
    for us. They got it! They even did this all in the TSMC process (180 I
    think if I remember correctly). The last paper I saw said the San Jose
    team's chips were on a shuttle waiting for the results to come back to
    their lab in Jackson Mississippi.

    Anyone know if that flow effort is still ongoing and if the results will be
    reported at CDNLive this September? I'd love to have a working flow out of
    the box in the TSMC 65 OpenAccess process.

    bkp
     
    Brenda Peters, Jun 25, 2007
    #1
  2. Brenda Peters

    dnh Guest

     
    dnh, Jun 26, 2007
    #2
  3. Brenda Peters

    dnh Guest

    dnh, Jun 26, 2007
    #3
  4. Brenda Peters

    Jim Tolar Guest

    Hey does this mean I can finally just down load from the foundry and
    Cadence an entire chip design and models and flow and software that works
    out of the boxes? Do any other foundries have this yet?

    And what will happen to my huge CAD group who spends most of their times
    developing our methodology and flows out of tools that were never built or
    tested together and which breaks with every new release of any component in
    the flow. Should my CAD department at least start with this and teach with
    this and debug with this tsmc thing?

    Is this Cadence TSMC 65 kit thing a new dimension in circuit design?
    Who built it? Cadence or the foundry? Or did they buy it from one of us
    already working? Do they test it so every thing that changes won't break
    our flow if we use it?

    jim
     
    Jim Tolar, Jun 29, 2007
    #4
  5. But I think you will have to pay for it.
    Do you happen to use *any* other tool in the chain not coming from
    Cadence? Then you will still need the CAD group.
    They have offered Kits for some time with a generic PDK to show the
    users how to use Cadence tools to do designs. These designs have
    mostly been of quite practical relevance, maybe bought from someboby
    or designed by VCAD for this purpose.

    Some people, me included, sees these kits as a result of the fairly
    high complexity when dealing with Cadence tools, which lead to a huge
    effort in support for Cadence when users start to think for
    themselves.
     
    Svenn Are Bjerkem, Jul 3, 2007
    #5
  6. Well, Tower is not on my list of vendors, pity. Hope it provides
    customer added value so that other foundries will follow.
     
    Svenn Are Bjerkem, Jul 19, 2007
    #6
  7. Brenda Peters

    John Gianni Guest

    H Svenn,

    I was a co-author of that paper at CDNLive last year (also delivered
    by Tower at EMEA).

    Mutual Tower/Cadence Customers said they shaved MONTHS off their
    schedule using this flow.
    One, in particular, mentioned in the paper by name, said they saved 9
    months in developing a second-source flow to TSMC.

    While the design was never the important point (the point was always
    to have a fully documented and working flow), the design used to test
    the flow was the Eaglet garage-door opener (often used in university
    flows) because it contains a small block of the major disciplines. The
    original eaglet stressed the flow because it contained full schematic,
    layout, simulation, extraction, and parasitic resimulation views for
    the combined chip which included an RF LNA & mixer, an analog op amp,
    a mixed-signal PLL and ADC, and a digital DSP where the FFT utilized
    RAM & ROM memory controlled by the DMA block). Eaglet was, in essence,
    a little bit of everything, combined with a complete document that
    outlined every single step of the flow, from start to finish.
    Thousands of product change requests were filed and fixed for this one
    design so that you, the consumer, would not have to find or file these
    bugs or enhancements necessary to run the complete flow.

    In addition, anyone could reproduce that complete documented &
    supported RF/Analog/Mixed-Signal/Digital/Memory/IO flow in a single
    day (assuming all the software were prior installed). That's quick-
    start value in and of itself.

    This Eaglet chip was (AFAIK), the only available design built and
    tested and fabricated and supplied to Customers as a foundry reference
    chip, at the time it was built years ago. As such, it was ground
    breaking for the industry as a whole and for the university community
    at large (as it was supplied to them as their classroom laboratory
    design of choice at the time via the Cadence Repository for Electronic
    Transfer & Exchange http://crete.cadence.com external web site).

    As you noted, it is great that the other foundries are taking note and
    following suit (more has been created since the groundbreaking Eaglet
    was released years ago).

    IMHO, all users will benefit from this and similar efforts at other
    foundries.

    As always, good luck in all that we do to raise capabilities,
    John Gianni
     
    John Gianni, Jul 23, 2007
    #7
  8. Brenda Peters

    John Gianni Guest

    As you noted, CRETE was pulled a while back (that's why I used the
    past tense).

    I haven't been involved in the university setting for a while so I'm
    not the one who knows.
    Maybe folks on the university side can pitch in (e.g., the wonderful
    folks over at NCSU and elsewhere doing full flows in a university
    setting) ...

    On the commercial side, there is a Tower-based flow (as noted); there
    are the TSMC "reference flows"; and I saw a recent announcement
    regarding Jazz (http://biz.yahoo.com/iw/070723/0280364.html) .... and
    I'm sure many more ... I'm just not the one to ask.

    Good luck ... I hope some of our university friends pitch in with
    further information,
    John Gianni
     
    John Gianni, Jul 25, 2007
    #8
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