Question regarding default co-ordinate system orientation in SW

Not trying to start a brawl with this question, just trying to understand why
the default co-ordinate system orientation in SW seems to be 'at odds'
with the rest of the world. I frequently exchange data with SW users and
find that their models are always rotated such that the X-Y plane is vertical
and the Z-axis horizontal. 'Real World' convention places the X-Y plane
horizontal (ie you're standing on it) and Z-Axis vertical - or in machining
parlance the X-Y plane is the table with long-travel in X-direction & spindle
(vertical) axis is Z.

I suspect the answer is simply that someone chose an 'arbitrary' orientation
for the default co-ordinate system in SW on Day 1, and it has been stuck
there ever since. Can anyone offer a more-definitive answer?

TIA

Rick Mason
MASCO Design Services Pty Ltd
Sydney, Australia - home of the world-famous APEC Circus

 

I don't understand where you obtain your sense of vertical and
horizontal. Sounds like you are coming from the civil sector. For the
civil sector there is an up and down and they refer to elevation and
plan views.

In SW the global XY direction is associated with the first default
plane that is, by default, labeled Front in the feature tree. It is
also associated with the Front View. Since you can label the first
default plane anything you want it is not clear what the issue is.
Also, since you can redefine the Front view to be anything you want it
is not clear what the issue is with SW. In other words, up and down is
determined by the user.

As to what is best practice I follow the procedure I taught in
Engineering Computer Graphics. The front view should:

a) Contain the least number of hidden lines

or

b) be the customary orientation of the part/assembly with the least
hidden lines.

So I will choose the first default plane (labeled front by default)
for the orientation that contains the fewest hidden lines. This allows
me to automatically create a drawing that is 80% done most of the
time.

Or if there is a customary orientation then I use that for the front
view.

If I am working on the part that somebody else thoughtlessly created
in some other orientation then I use the redefine view option to get
my front view in the drawing.

TOP

 

No, purely mechanical (although not in the wind-up sense). The
question relates to the default orientation of the co-ordinate system
for which there are several conventions - however, the one which I
have always found to be universally accepted in engineering modeling
is the one which I described with X-Y plane parallel to ground.

- OK, I'm understanding better how the initial selection is made.
If X-Y Plane = 'Front' orientation as selected, then this is indeed at
odds with engineering modeling convention as I interpret it, where
the X-Y plane is associated with the TOP view.

- thus you are taking a drawing-based approach to the orientation
of the part rather than an 'As Used' or Assembly / In-Car approach.

It is just possible that the person who created the model in some other
orientation did so thoughtFULLY, following valid model-based rules!

Thanks for the input,

Rick.

 

This isn't even really true all the time since anyone can name their
planes any thing they want. You could name them after the 3 stooges or
the 3 bears or the 3 glockenschpiels. I think in early SW default
templates they were Plane 1, Plane 2 and Plane 3. Mine are named XY, ZX
and YZ, which makes no directional assumption at all.

Front Top and Right are arbitrary names established in your document
templates. The individual user or company is responsible for the way
they are used.

Daisy.

 

Take a page from Ayn Rand.
X=X
Y=Y
Z=Z

Front, right, top, etc. are conventions that vary by industry and
discipline.

 

Get bored with posting at the over moderated Eng-Tips already?

I'm sorry I can't give you any "pink stars" for your post. ;>)

 

What's the problem? You know in our shop we've got some lowlife
neanderthal in a greasy wifebeater t-shirt who calls himseolf a
"precision machinist". I just get that image every time I see you post.
Warm hearted smile! Has a reading level almost equal to JB's. Missing
the first two joints of both index fingers, and a big scar on his cheek
from when some work he fixtured let loose while he was messing with it
and the machine was running. Makes me think of you.

Daisy.

 

Such hostility. You know, someone did a background check and found that
Mike Tyson was a machinist before he started taking Zoloft and Lithium
and became only a rage filled boxer.

Daisy.

 

Such hostility. You know, someone did a background check and found
that

Pushing Up Daisies,

Mike Tyson wasn't a boxer. He was a brawler.

Michael Carbajal was a boxer.

 

Wow what a fucking whack job--hopefully, this particular individual in no

Actually I think he's much better than the average SolidWorks user but
that's not really a compliment based on the crap I often see done....
sketches not fully defined where they easily could be, no
understanding of master model or skeletal modeling, edges of the model
referenced instead of something that is less likely to change and not
make the Feature Manager light up like a Hanukah bush, etc.

 

yes, but for whom?

Daisy.

 

What use would I have for groups like: (quoting from your cross posted
troll)

alt.penguin-fetish, alt.penguin-fetish.recovery,
alt.penguins.bondage.latex.springs.bounce.bounce.bounce,
alt.penis.erland-sommarskog.slapp, alt.battlestar-galactica,
alt.usenet.kooks, alt.abduckted.by.lezbian-vampires.flonk.flonk.flonk



Sounds like groups frequented by retarded machinists, so you would know
more about that than the rest of us.

Very nice collection. Now we know where you're going on that computer
when you say you're working.

Daisy.

 

Certainly it isn't you Flower Twat

--
Regards,
Steve Saling
aka The Garlic Dude ©
Gilroy, CA
The Garlic Capital of The World
http://tinyurl.com/2avg58

 

Very true.
As I design, I use the Front, Right, and Top planes to help me
understand and orient the product. I make my decisions by 'What would
an average user of the rpoduct say is the front, the top, or the
right?' This is, generally (though there are exceptions) how I will
model. It simplifies things - if it is an assembly, I don't have to
worry about opening a part form the right view of the assembly and see
its front when I get into the model -I don't hae to change my view of
the total deal when working on just a part of it. This prevents, for
instance, adding detail on the 'back' back of the part that will
actually be on the 'front' of it when I get back to the assembly. it
also makes it easier to understand for anyone I am showing it to or
passing it on to for aditional design work

SWx is nice that the designer can design with the users mindset in
mind, then the drafter can change the orientation of the part to pick
the FRONT view that make the best drawing for the part, and the
machinist can chosse the best orientation for machining the part. This
makes a lot of sense.

After all, orientation is entirely arbitrary. I can put a product in
your hand and you can hold it the way the user would hold it, or you
can hold it in the direction of pull of the molded parts, or you can
hold it in the way shown in the drawings. Let each professional in
the process make the most informed choice of component orientation for
their part of the process (for instace, anyone making SLA's will
choose the thinnest section, usually, to be the Z direction to reduce
build time. As Paul stated, this may not be the best for the drafter.
It doesn't matter - its 3D, rotate the part!)

 

@free.teranews.com:

Maybe you need to actually get out and DO some actual work for a change.
Any damage done was probably because some SW poser sent a part to the
machinist that couldn't be clamped properly because it _looked pretty_ in
SW.


--
Anthony

You can't 'idiot proof' anything....every time you try, they just make
better idiots.

Remove sp to reply via email

 

How would you fire me if you are working for me? Clearly a dreamer.
Inventive, but deluded.

You're just too much fun to pull around by that little ring in your
nose. Touchy, insecure, undereducated, predictable. Are all chip
sweepers this sensitive?

Daisy.

 

Oh my, original content.....

 

[
Israeli leader Ehoud Olmert comes to Washington for meetings with George W.
For the State Dinner, Laura Bush decides to bring in a special Kosher Chef
and have a truly Jewish meal prepared in honor of their guest.

At the dinner that night, the first course is served and it is Matzoh Ball
Soup.

George W. looks at this and, after learning what it is called, he tells an
aide that he can't eat such a gross and strange-looking brew.

The aide says that Mr. Olmert will be insulted if he doesn't at least taste
it.

Not wanting to cause any trouble (after all he ate a sheep's eye in honor of
his Arab guests), George W. gingerly lowers his spoon into the bowl and
retrieves a piece of matzoh ball and some broth. He hesitates, swallows, and
a grin appears on his face. He finds he really likes it, digs right in, and
finishes the whole bowl.

"That was delicious," he says to Olmert. "Do the Jews eat any other part of
the matzoh, or just the balls?"
]

 

- but it would seem that the X-Y plane orentation which then 'travels'
with the model is thus assigned to what is, in fact a 'paper' orientation
(ie the plane of the drawing-sheet) regardless of the original modeling
intent. Surely the underside of the model in its preferred orientation for
assembly should dictate the ground (X-Y) plane, rather than a Drawing
view? Other considerations such as line-of-draw can easily be captured
in the model as secondary references / PMI.

- I agree with the 'flexible' approach but not with 'arbitrary' or 'random'
orientation. Our 'in house' rule is to model as assembled, as displayed in
catalog/data-sheet or as common sense dictates if no other clues exist.
Common sense, of course, is a very uncommon commodity!

At least now I understand WHY all the SW models we receive are turned
with their primary profile skywards!!

Thanks to the (few) professionals who responded.

Rick.

 

Have you looked into "Update Standard Views"? Look in the help under
"View --> orientation". You can choose a new orientation for what is
"Front", "Top", "Right", etc.

What it does not do is rename datum planes that might be named by
orientation.

p.s. pardon me if this was already discussed. I did not see it
amongst the noise.