PDMWorks 2003(doesn't works ever)

Ok, I now admit defeat, this is the most stupid piece of software that I
have ever come across.

Drawing numbers??
Q: How am I able to use the same drawing number for two different drawings?
A: Because pdmworks lets you! HUH?

Q: How do I know what the last drawing number I used was?
A: I don't, unless I write it down or do a report, no wait, lots of reports
for every part, assembly or drawing I have ever drawn to see what the last
number was! Can't see this working very well with more than one user.

Q: How do I find a part that is used in more than one assembly?
A: Scroll down this HUGE file list in pdmworks explorer or do a search,
because I can remember every name that I gave a file, yer right sure I can!

At the moment I create a root directory with the projects name, and then sub
directories, example:-

C:\RSC
C:\COMMON\Panelwork
C:\COMMON\Engineering
C:\COMMON\Vessels
C:\COMMON\Assemblys
C:\RSC200
C:\RSC\RSC200\Panelwork
C:\RSC\RSC200\Engineering
C:\RSC\RSC200\Vessels
C:\RSC\RSC200\Assemblies
C:\RSC250
C:\RSC\RSC250\Panelwork
C:\RSC\RSC250\Engineering
C:\RSC\RSC250\Vessels
C:\RSC\RSC250\Assemblies

This works great because ANYONE can find the files that they want. The
problems come when I check in these into pdmworks, there is no longer a file
structure, they are all dumped into one project folder, I.e.:- ALL of the
files used on the RSC200 are dumped in ONE project folder and SOME of the
RSC250 are dumped into another project folder. I then open an RSC250
assembly and ALL of the parts, sub assemblies, etc are dumped into ONE
working folder. I now have 3 copies of every document, 1 in the vault, 1
copy of the vault document in the working directory and the original in my
own directories!. Don't even mention "delete local copy", If you do this
before checking in the drawing document, there will be no link to the part
or assembly document. Nope it doesn't automatically check in the drawing
documents, YOU have got to remember to do this! Why can't you just select
the root folder and check the whole lot in at once, (including the drawing
documents), and KEEP the folder organisation, even when checking out?
Drawing Lists? I want to be able to list and then print out, all of the
panelwork for ONE type of machine, Can't be done! Huh? The sheet metal
workshop wants only these drawings, they don't want the engineering
drawings! I have to sift through ALL of the drawing documents to find them
and print them off, ONE AT A TIME! AHHHH! All that pdmsworks is, is a great
BIG box where you through everything in!
Is there a "REAL" filing system that works?

 

I doubt that, especially if you've used Outlook or Word.

PDMWorks, like a lot of other PDM applications, keys off of the
filename. A lot of people just make the "Number" field the same as the
filename, and avoid the problem you're having.

People who want to use sequential part numbers either write or get
someone else to write a little database interface that keeps track of
this for them and assigns numbers.

Well, there are going to be a lot of disappointed people who are using
this with good success in small, medium and large engineering
departments when they hear your edict.

What's wrong with the search? You can search on more than just the
filename. Also a lot of people put the parts in a separate folder
which is non-hierarchical, so they can be browsed by file name.

You have the option on check in to send any of the referenced documents
to a different project folder.

There are ways of doing what you are talking about. No need to get so
upset.

Well, first of all because it doesn't work that way, and if you tried
to understand what you bought before you bought it, you might know
that. PDMWorks was not meant to replicate your Windows Explorer
environment, nor should it.


I

I'll bet it can be done, you should say that you can't do it. There
are people who make a living helping companies understand and set up
software to make it work best for the way they want to work.

So why did you set it up the way you did?


I

That's because you don't know how to organize folders or use custom
properties or the SW2004 batch scheduler.

PDMWorks is neither a "great big box" nor a "filing system". It's a
workgroup or departmental CAD PDM system.

If you want answers and for PDMWorks to be a useful tool, then email
me. If you just want to rant, then have at it, and good luck.


Matt Lombard
Implementation Manager
Trimech Solutions

 

I think I have a "right" to get "upset", (as you so kindly put it,), it will
not work, as I explained to my VAR, the way I wanted it to work. I was going
to reply in depth to your comments, but you come across as a very smug
person. BTW, IF you had read the message header properly, you would have
seen that this is about pdmworks 2003, NOT Pdmworks 2004. So your last
comments are utter rubbish. Yes I was letting off steam, "BUT" I was also
asking questions. Your smug, "I can up my own arsehole", replies, were
beneficial to no one but yourself!

 

Pete,
If you had been here long you would know that Matt is one of the most highly
respected "regulars" on this board. His replies were just the other side of
tongue-in-cheek, and kept within your original "attitudistic" post. Yep, he
can come across as smug - but he can also help you out. Please reconsider
your demeanor and kindly ask the questions in a way that will illicite some
constructive replies.

Richard Doyle

 

on a lighter note ...
matt's reply holds true for 2003 too

it sounds as though you may have been misled (from var or whoever) about
what pdmworks does.

 

So has, and is, the Queen, but if she replied to my post in this way, she
would have got the same reply.
I don't try to "look down my nose" at person when I respond to their post,
even if they are ranting.
People have to earn respect from each new person they meet. Yourself and
others may respect him, but at the moment he has not got mine.

 

Thanks Ken, I will try that tommow

 

That's a first for me, being compared to the Queen (of England, I'm
guessing).

If you took that chip off your shoulder you might learn a few things
here.

<plonk>

matt

 

I do learn from here, no chip, just don't accept arsehole comments from
stuck up prats. Period!

 

Pete,

I agree with your first email unreservedly. I also think that the way
PDMworks has been marketed is completely misleading. Since it now is a
SolidWorks product and people don't understand the implicaions behind
PDM, be that at single user, workgoup or enterprise level, there is a
tendency to buy all of the SolidWorks portofolio (since they are
associated with a geat product like SW itself) and try and use them
later.

The main problem with PDMworks is it has to have its own way! It also
is so easily "upset", tampered with, as you say it would need other
systems to even keep track of part numbers, you can forget workflow,
categorization, true multiple dependencies and relationships, no
multisite, no take your laptop of the office one day with the files
and mess about out of the network, no...... to be honnest, i can't
believe SW corp bought this and furthermore they still have kept the
original name "PDM"-works which is the biggest misleading BS i have
come across. I don't think it does SW's image any good.

Most of the companies that have bought PDMworks as part of SW office
pro, have not even opened it (this a true quote from a VAR).

I have played with it over the past few years just to keep in touch
with its progress and hate to think people use this for real projects!

Pete, i would also give these guys(who replied to your email) a break,
obviously they have seen nothing better, or are trying hard to justify
their solution of choice to someone else (who hopefully might read
these threads now and then)


Kind Regards

Tony.K

 

(Tony. K) wrote in

Could you describe what makes you think this? Please be specific rather
than just making a blind claim. I'm interested to see where they have done
this.

Yes, I agree with you here.

That could be, but companies should not spend their money on a product
without checking to see if it meets their needs. I'm not sure SW is to
blame for people buying software without investigating it.

If by that you mean it's not customizable, then yes, you're correct. In
general all software suffers from this to some extent. There is an API
available, but that significantly adds to the cost of the investment. For
some companies it's worth the extra expense.

On the other hand, PDMWorks may be much more flexible than you think. You
need more than a casual familiarity with the software to pass judgment on
this aspect. Again, if you offer something specific, it would be helpful
in understanding your point of view.

PDMWorks does not have an automatic part number generator, it is keyed off
of the filename, which is already assigned before documents get to PDMW.
You can use any system you like or create your own to assign part numbers /
filenames.

To be fair, PDMWorks does not claim to have a "workflow" module in the
common PDM sense (like SmarTeam, ProductCenter or Conisio for example). It
does have some tools that can be used "like" portions of workflow, such as
lifecycle status and triggers / notifications (part of the additional cost
advanced server). It doesn't have a flow chart or rules based routing,
aside from what you might be able to do with the notifications.

I'm not sure what you're getting at here, but PDMW certainly does have the
capability for a part or document to be referenced by multiple documents.
This data is displayed in the Where Used. In terms of categorization, this
sort of thing can be accomplished with custom properties or vault
structure. It is certainly not as sophisticated as systems that cost 10X
what PDMW costs, but I'm not sure anyone would expect that to be the case.

If physically separate sites are connected via a VPN, they can use the same
vault. What you may be talking about is that some PDM systems (that cost
much more than PDMWorks) can have synchronized databases in different
locations. PDMWorks does not have this ability, mainly because it does not
use a database. It's a low cost, low maintenance departmental CAD document
management system.

That is simply incorrect. You can take documents out of the vault, go on
vacation to Hawaii with your laptop, change the files on the beach sipping
Mai Tais, come back to work and check them back into the vault, or log into
the VPN from your hotel room and check them in from there.

Also, as part of the additional cost advanced server, the Web Portal will
allow anyone with a web browser, access behind your firewall and a username
and password to view and print from your PDMW vault.

Again, please elaborate. It sounds like you may be trying to compare
PDMWorks to a high end PDM system.

I suspect this varies greatly depending on if the reseller knows how to
help you implement the software. The same can be said about SmarTeam
(although I think the word "most" overstates the case).

Ok, this is your real chance to bash the product. Tell us exactly what is
wrong with PDMWorks. Specifically.

Hmm. I bought, took training, and implemented ProductCenter with workflow
for 20 users a couple of years ago where I used to work. I had a pretty
good understanding of the product. I've been trained on SmarTeam, I had
Conisio installed on my computer until I reformatted it last week. I've
sat through demos and investigated other products like DBWorks,
Quicksilver, Agile.

PDMWorks is the simplest of the products that I have any familiarity with.
If you already have SW Office, PDMWorks will cost another $500 (+ maint)
per user with no additional cost for the vault, unless you want the
"advanced server" (web portal, API, triggers/notifications). It does not
use a database. You don't need much IT expertise to administer it (unless
you're using the advanced server). It is meant to be run by the
engineering dept. Updating Oracle databases is something that requires a
lot more knowledge than you need to administer PDMW.

I've seen PDMWorks in installations from 2 to 100 users. Most of the
people who are dissatisfied with it are people who are trying to make the
software do something it is not meant to do. I can't really say if
salesmen are selling people software on false expectations or not. If you
have evidence of this happening, I'm sure SW would like to hear about it.

If you are comparing PDMWorks to a high end PDM system, could you tell us
which one? Resellers don't have any interest in trying to sell PDMWorks to
people who should be using an expensive high end system, mainly because
there is a lot more money in the high end. Companies can easily spend well
over 6 figures ($100,000) on say a SmarTeam implementation for example.
High end PDM is completely configurable, limited only by your imagination
and how much money you throw at it. Implementation for SmarTeam can take 6
months depending on what you're trying to do. With PDMWorks, the product
can usually be implemented in 2 or 3 days, again, depending. There is a
huge difference in scale of the products, cost of the products, and what
you should expect the products to be capable of.

I wouldn't go as far as to say that PDMWorks is faultless, but for what it
is intended to do, I think it is pretty good. If you have specific
complaints, I'm interested to hear you out.

matt

 

Thank you!
I thought I was the only one who thought this way. I have tried to use it
all this week, but I still can not seem to understand this product. I have
had Solidworks 2004 office pro sitting in my desk for 3 weeks now, and when
I get time,(lol) to install it, I will leave pdmworks off.
I highly disagree with Matt on the comment he made,"You don't need much IT
expertise to administer it". I had a IT specialist look at this program and
in his words, "This program is utter pants!", I also showed this program to
an IBM employee, guess what? the same sort of reply, but a lot more rude!
Catia anyone?

In the UK, EVERY insurance Document MUST have a drawing number, this
number MUST be linked to the FILE name, there must NOT be any duplication of
a document number or of a file name. Our Insurance company requires this, so
hopefully now, Matt can see one of my problems.

The drawing documents must be accessible by anyone that may require
them, Sales team, Shop floor, Production manager and of course the design
office. (minimum IT experience?, Hmmm....)

I have quite a few years of IT experience, almost 25 years, I worked on the
Z80 to begin with, gosh, I'm getting old!
But it seems that I haven't quite reached, the minimum experience required
yet, blooming hell!

Oh well, back to the drawing board!, lol

 

I agree with Matt,

PDMWorks is a workgroup vault not an enterprise PLM solution.
If you're looking for something beyond check-in, check-out and
revision control, I can understand why PDMWorks might not be the right
solution.

There is one interesting aspect of PDMWorks that could be considered
either a pro or con. PDMWorks is file based versus object based. The
con side of this is that the vault can become very large (lots of disk
storage required) and when you refresh the vault, it can take minutes.
The pro of it is that there is an option to store the "latest" copy of
a file. This is important if the time comes when you want to upgrade
to an enterprise wide PLM solution. The reason I mention this is that
some PDM/PLM products encrypt the files. If you need to move them to
another product, you could get cranky.