OT Boeing strike

Cliff, you should be a bit more considerate of opposing views in what
is mostly an arena populated by observable detectable facts, and then
conjecture and extrapolation into the future.

Long term Solar cycles (even only hundreds of years) are poorly
understood, along with singularly directional coronal mass ejections,
which could dramatically alter the earth's atmosphere and
magnetosphere. As far as we know, we have no high level CMEs which
have hit the earth in industrial times, but we have seen them ocurr in
directions away from the earth. I don't know if anyone has been able
to estimate the results from such a direct impact.

If you spoke to people in Northern Europe in the 1590-1620 era, they
would tell you something to the effect that the climate has switched
and N. Europe was doomed, because crop failures were rampant.
Scientists think that was associated directly with lower solar output
as a result of fewer Sunspots.

Why? When will it happen again, if ever? What will it do if it does,
and how fast?

There are far more ingredients to climate than many commentators are
looking at or generally aware of. That is why PHD climatologists have
their work cut out for themselves trying to make sense of the
predictions about climate over the range of decades to a century or so.

There are NO definitive answers yet.

Bo

 

I am, when they have the right ones.

And have effects of quite limited duration.

To the climate?
Consider the unit energy and compare it to the annual solar
input.

Huh?
It seems that the Gulf Stream had changed it's flow for a bit.
The effect was not global. Warmed up Greenland too IIRC.
See "Little Ice Age"? Something like that.

Changes to he gulf stream seem much more probable if the North
polar ice cap melts. Or as the Gulf of Mexico warms up even more.

Global warming is not about specific local climate changes,
except that they will exist.
Example: As the North polar ice cap melts the SW US
is likely to have less rain.

To the winter snow on Dec 27 in Bute in 2098? Nope.

Did you catch the avalanche effect bit?
See the "Greenhouse Earth" bit at
http://palaeo.gly.bris.ac.uk/Palaeofiles/Triassic/exttheory.htm#2. Greenhouse Earth

There's LOTS more. Search.

 

It is all energy in versus energy out. Anectodal evidence of one
particular feature of the earths environment does not define cyclic
behavior (unless it may be some replies hereabouts).

I posted the CO2 level link showing ups and downs coinciding with the
last major climatalogical eras, where major shifts occur about every
100,000 years. Our current rising CO2 levels are right in there with
past cycles right on time.

What we do not understand is what drove those CO2 levels up and then
what drove them down, and why they repeat every 100,000 years or so.

Until science data can show why the behavior existed, we have very
little chance of understanding what is going on today, let alone
influencing it in any significant way.

Bo

 

We very well know what's driving them up now.
The burning of fossil fuels.

You speak of 100,000 + year "cycles". This is not a
100,000 year "cycle", if such even exist. The effects
are seen in decades: The glaciers & ice caps are melting
very rapidly. That's one of the things absorbing the extra
heat, as are the oceans (water expands as it's warmed
BTW thus raising the sea levels. Warming also *reduces*
the soluability of CO2 in the water).

Will we run out of cheap fossil fuels before it's too late?
Think on that one too. Many think that peak oil has been
recently reached ....

 

Cliff, your words above reveal your inability to look at, read about or
even comprehend basic science and the English languages uses of words
to descrive observable facts.

I suggest you go back to the Usenet groups who discuss comic books
about super heroes as they are the real people, and they do "real"
things.

Geesh - Bo

 

It's too bad that no reputable climatologist, physicist
or atmospheric chemist would agree with you.
I tried to keep it simple for you <G>.

Do you spend a lot of time chanting? Donating to
the fundies & wingers?

 

Baloney.

Jobs go overseas for the usual reasons, 75% because it is trendy.
Probably 15% because theoretically useful usenet groups get taken
over by off-topic threads...


Can we go back on topic now, please?

 

WHAT?
In a clearly marked "OT" thread?
Is that even allowed?

 

Cliff, you are dead wrong. You didn't read my prior notes, you did not
look at the pulicly available chart I cited on the ice core CO2 levels
over the last 1/2 million years and their relations to climate epochs.

No "eputable climatologist, physicist or atmospheric chemist" has
challenged those findings or what their implications are.

It is a matter of scientific fact.

Bo

 

Nope. Not your conclusions. That was all that needed to be
noted.
Sorry.

BTW, Who is telling you this junk science stuff?

 

BTW, I did try to look at it: "The page cannot be found"

One worries so about those with eputable reputations.

Not that I know what you are actually going on about now ...
other than the fact that Mars has seasons .... ?

So seems (fact) to be that meteor that crashed into Mexico.
If you see another one coming, that's okay, right? After
all, it's happened before .....
Do you happen to have "conservative" leanings?

 

Science data does not know conservative or liberal. Grow up.

These summaries of scientific measurements stand as fact unless you can
disprove them!

http://www-class.unl.edu/geol101i/15c_glaciers.htm
http://www-class.unl.edu/geol101i/images/climate images/Glaciers/CO2
Vostok with Ice Ages.gif

I am not going to bother replying with further data, as you either
can't or won't read it.

I responded just this far to allow your own words to hang your
reputation out for others to see, and you did it.

 

we sure can - my apologies for the wide OT diversion folks...
as a closer however...I think you underestimate what's happening
considerably - it is a trend but it is actually about smart money getting
out of America - a lot of analysts are picking that about 2040 the US will
be an also ran in world affairs...which will be an uncomfortable thought for
many to grasp.
neil.

 

"The low spots of CO2 correspond to glacial advances."
IOW It ended up colder, right?

"The page cannot be found"

IOW It seems that you don't even know what any of this
is about.

What did you think that "global warming" and CO2 were about?
Who told you?

BTW, You'd best compare those listed CO2 levels to present
and projected ones.

HTH

 

To amplify a bit Neil, what I think is happening is a bit more complex,
with longer term implications.

I manufacture several types of medical products. Some are so simple
with so little skill, and the pricing in the U.S. is so low from our
competitors, that in order to compete, I redesigned the product to
perform better, use less material, mold faster, & assemble easier, &
produce it in Mexico. This allows me to compete and gain market share
with now what is a superior product, over the competitors.

As time goes on, I hope to automate the assembly & do it back in the
U.S.

It is never simple, easy, or the whole picture clear, but in its own
way, offshoring is an advancement which can ultimately bring gains to
us.

It is obvious that we need a forceful U.S. government to not allow our
companies to be steamrolled in various ways. We need to lobby our
legislators on some foreign trade & currency valuation issues.