Important for everybody

Even if it was created off site, off comany time??

Maybe. Was it the company's copy of AutoCAD? Is the writing these things and
bringing them in considered part of your job description? Do you have any
written understanding with the company on this? (Probably not.) Would they
be in any way surprised if you deleted everything single thing you had
written when you left the firm. (Probably.)

I've given the authoritative site reference twice earlier in the thread.
Read for yourself. Generally, if you're on the payroll, and it's considered
as part of your job, and you're making use of company "facilities," then
they own it. If your programming depends on using a company copy of Acad, or
a company computer, that would probably be viewed as using their
"facilities" whether you were on site or off.

If they've been led to believe that all this offsite programming is part of
the benefit of having you on the payroll, then it may be viewed as part of
your job description, even if it's your own independent copy of Acad that
you're using. That wouldn't be quite as clearcut, but it's quite possible
that you've surrendered your ownership by bringing them in and spreading
them around as part of your routine, thereby making it seem like part of
your job.

The only way to learn the actual "legal" answer is hire lawyers and start
suing. If you'd prefer to avoid that, then you need to sit down with your
employer and hash it out. And put it in writing. Soon.

If you want "your" stuff to really be yours, you need a very clear agreement
on it. You probably ought to own your own Acad, have a one-man business
name, and "sell" your stuff to the company (either an outright sale or on a
license basis). If you aren't contracting this activity with them in a way
that is clearly separate from your employment, or have a written agreement
that they'll share the rights with you, it's entirely possible that you've
already given your programs away.

 

those gosh drat lawyers!

 

To a degree you are correct. I have lsp routines I wrote as far back as 1986. At that time, they were very, very unusual and I was highly protective of them. However, as time went by, many other people
began writing similar routines so I now don't consider them "intelectual property" - heck, I give them away now without a second thought.

But there is another side to this - the company doesn't have the expertise to develope lsp routines or change them when Autodesk changes something in their core.

 

Copyright laws no long require )c) or copyright notice.

 

And wouldn't it be somewhat hard to "nail down" what is a copy write
infringment as far as a lot of the "simple" lisp is concerned?

Bill, look at http://www.copyright.gov . You can't copyright a concept,
idea, method, or process. A copyright isn't a patent. You don't have to
prove originality. Copyright protects "original works of authorship" which
are "fixed in a tangible form of expression."

More than one company can copyright a map of the same town, for instance.
Each of them is protecting only their specific hardcopy map (the tangible
expression) from being literally duplicated. They aren't protecting anything
else.

Things that are utterly mundane (like lists of telephone numbers) or purely
dictated by function (certain engineering structures) aren't subject to
copyright protection. If the lisp is that simple, it's probably either not
fit to be copyrighted, or not worth suing anybody over. If an average jury
would consider one work to be clearly "derivative" of another (coprighted)
work, then that would be an infringement.

The only way things ultimately get "nailed down" is by seeing who wins in
court.












routines at your company - once

think so or not. Been there - done

here to develop) is already out there (maybe slightly different but
accomplishes the same thing).

(as I knew nothing about lisping before I got here) so I have no problem
"giving" them what I've done here.

because you also need the person behind it that can improvise maintain and
improve the programs to keep things on the cutting edge.

 

But there is another side to this - the company doesn't have the expertise to develope lsp routines or change them when Autodesk changes something in their core.<<

I was getting at that same thing when I said:

"I believe also that no written programming will ever carry a company because you also need the person behind it that can improvise maintain and improve the programs to keep things on the cutting edge."



I would say "job security" but I hate that term.

My supervisors have also said that they hate to see the companies success rest entirely on what I've done here.
They seem to think that if something happens to me or I retire someday, they won't be able to fill my shoes.
It's hard to believe, now that I look back, that I had so much trouble convincing them that this was the way to go in the first place.
Again, it's the man behind the code that makes it work.

Bill

Bill

 

I know that, but it is still good practice I would think.

Bye the way (since I AM the company), anything I write
is OK for the 'company' to have rights to. )

Bob

 

Hi Amit,

Most of the discussion has been around your rights to do this. The primary
answer to your first question, 'Is it legal to sell you programs? Of course
it is.

Accepting that you have all the rights you need (and it's quite possible you
are not USA based and therefore subject to different and less company
orientated copyright rules), then you have to work on the marketing of your
program.

Search the web for lisp and other programs which enhance AutoCAD, and it is
quite possible you will find freeware which does similar things to your
program. You need to be sure that your program is adequately different from
these other programs such that users will want to buy it.

How can you establish a reputation such that potential purchasers will think
"Amit" has the solution for me?

How can a user feel confident that you will be in business next year to
provide support for the program?

Can you continue to eat if sales remain low?

How can you demonstrate what the program does?

Do you need help files?

How an you ensure you get paid?

What is your refund policy?

How do you secure the program?

How do you quality check it? Is it operating system sensitive?

Which versions of AutoCAD does it run on?

Do you update for new AutoCAD version? Free?

I suspect you will find the marketing issues far more significant than the
technical ones.

--


Laurie Comerford
CADApps
www.cadapps.com.au

lisp and menus. Compatible with acad 2000/4/5.

 

Hmm. That *is* a while ago, even prior to the Battle of Hastings!

 

Many many Thanks Laurie &
also thanks to all who replied me,

laurie your reply is really useful for me.
i noted your all points. i am trying to take care of all of them.

well,
my software is almost completed now. and i can say its a fastet piping isometric drafting software in the world.
i customised it very deep after my 11 years as piping designer and cad experience.
hope peoples will like it.

most important point is lock of software. its just difficult to lock a software with perticular computer, coz many ways are there to break.
as my experience. i also tried to break lot of codes. personally i can lock the my lsp prog. with pericular computer by disk serial no. but i cant reach to my each clients. also it will not work if formated the harddisk.
even registri entries can be also hacked.
lets see what happends..

actually I tried registry in 4 to locations combine + text log files on harddisk as my software lock.

But still I feel it if not good. [may be 5 peoples in 100 can break my codes].

Pls advice me best locking procedure. Hardware part or software lock
also advice if any marketing site for lisp programs.

regards,
Amit

 

thanks jan,
i'm really very happy. after reading ur reply
u are the 1st person who replied me. and its in positive way.

thanks again
Amit

 

Attn: Anne,

Hi again, here is another one. At work (nttp) I see nothing nested under
the following quoted post, but I know there is because I see it on the web
and at home (also nttp).

<feeling pest-like>

 

James -

It has to be something on your work set up. Can you delete nntp
there and reinstall?

The web team has not found anything amiss with the three
structure and I've seen no other reports like yours. I truly wish
I could do more.

Not pest like - just wanting your messages!

Anne

 

typo - three is supposed to be tree.

Anne

 

Anne,
We juth thought you were lithping with uth. ;-)
Regards,
Doug

 

Thank you Anne. I will try that. But it will be at home and work (remember
I see the same problem both places). By "delete nntp" do you just mean
un/re install OE and Outlook, or is there something more to it, or totally
different...?

In the meantime, is it possible that this post is related? -

Anne wrote >"Not pest like - just wanting your messages!"

Well, yeah, but more concerned that it's not just me. Switching back and
forth between home and work, I figure I'm probably catching most if not all
of them. But if I were on either one alone I certainly would not be.

Thank you,

James

 

James -

here are saved messages from others who have lost threads in the
past. I do not use OE so point you to Microsoft groups if you
need more info.

Anne
---
Anne Brown
Discussion Groups Administrator
Autodesk, Inc.

MISSING MESSAGES

In Outlook Express, if you want to get all the headers in one
shot, rmb on
the group, and go to Properties >> Local Files Tab >> Reset.
That will
remove everything from the group. Then RMB on the group and go
to
Synchronization Settings >> Headers Only.

Finally without going into the group by left clicking during all
this, go to
Tools >> Synchronize All. Allow it to run and it should get all
the
headers in one shot.

----
Microsoft Outlook Express 6
(http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;EN-US;171164)

Go to tools/options/maintenance and uncheck delete news messages
x days
after being downloaded. You will then retain all messages.
Right click on
the discussion.autodesk.com and choose reset groups. Redownload
the
messages.

or

Menu item "View"MISSING , "Current View" choose "Show all
messages"

Also choose "Tools" - "Options" -"maintenance" and unclick
"Delete read
message bodies in newsgroups" and "Delete messages older than
____ days"

or
more information may be found at msnews.microsoft.com
/microsoft.public.windows.inetexplorer.ie6_outlookexpress or at
"Inside Outlook Express" at http://insideoe.tomsterdam.com/

 

Forgot to say I've also asked the server admin folk to take a
look and be sure the NNTP and HTTP sides of the server are in
synch.

 

Hi Bob,

thanks for your advice.
if not mistaken u are also a seller of autolisp programs.
i think i've seen eccad site.
can u advice me code for protect my program to avoid piracy?
pls. reply

regards
Amit

 

Nice one I Admit.

I thought you whee Alex J. I loved that guy.

Anyway welcome back after sometime off keep em guessing but
I think I am closing in!

Regards Gary