Examples of good UI

hell he won't even provide sample files...
Well I 'm not sure you can hang that on Mark he's probably just too
busy with other responsibilities to attend to it.
I think he goes out of his way to do those presentations anyway.
They aren't typical of the promo stuff SW was producing previously
that attracted some scornful comment for being fluff so most likely
you could appreciate that and the fact he is prepared to at least
appear here to answer some questions about it. Marketing would
probably like to mangle them given the opportunity...

I am inclined to believe Mark probably disliked the recent UI changes
being an ex user and all round good guy but he has a job to do...I
think it is more likely he is enmeshed in a somewhat unresponsive
system with somewhat confused goals..but I agree with your scepticism
and I do sorta wonder about the commitment and motivation behind this.
As I stated we have been there before and then when we had an
expectation there were things being done to optomise and incorporate
things people asked for we got something kind of incongruous and
warped dumped on us.
I wonder myself how this happened. SW themselves must surely have the
ability to do in depth studies or more likely have made the studies
and yet its like someone completely disregarded all that...
It seems to me if Mark is asking around for ideas or examples then
someone has made a decision to revisit this and the result will
probably appear in about 18 months or perhaps even 9 if they are
spooked by it.
Realistically conversations with SW are one sided so I wouldnt really
expect that ideas thrown up here will actually have any impact on what
they are going to do...so I do wonder what is the point of them
asking.
If I look at the responses to Marks post they are basically nothing he
couldnt find in a search...and I note the respondants are pretty much
the same people as always.I hope he appreciates the time we took to
reply in good faith.

 

John,

Not as bad as it sounds since eBay is only one outlet for them. They
seem to make a good product and hopefully in return a good living. I
just wanted to point out that they are not making the killing that Jon
thinks they are.

Plus there are costs involved with producing the tutorials, marketing,
packaging, selling, overhead as well as gross sales are not the same
as net.

Tom

 

Jon thinks everyone else is making some sort of killing. He's an idiot.
JOn's judgement failed him when he dropped out of school and he's been
making one poor decision after another his entire life. Training masterial
for banqueer would have to be dumbed down toi the third grade "Barney" level
and he'd still complain about the way the book tasted without salt and
pepper.

I'm sure it's a good product or sales would be zero and there would be a lot
of negetive feed back.
That seems not to be the case.

I seem to remember hearing that somewhere <G>


One of the things that is worth remembering about training materials is that
they anticipate a student who will go beyond the covered material to become
an accomplished and experience end user. They aren't intended to be a
substitute for skill, thinking skills or experience.

Hey, I'm up in San Jose again and was hoping to escape the LA heat. NO SUCH
LUCK.

J

 

F'n hot today in Orange & Riverside Counties.

 

Hey guys I know you like to give Jon a hard time but can you try not
to bury threads in it.
I presume you have an interest in SW or you wouldnt subscribe to the
group.
Do you have any comments to add about what makes or breaks an
interface?
I presume you are SW users too or have it at your workplace?
What would you like to see or not see done to change things?
Have you tried SW08 at all? What did you think about it?
I suspect the shopfloor have a different but no less important
perspective on CAD than the desk jockeys.
I'd like to hear what you have to say.
Any CNC programs you use that you think have a great interface? or
perhaps some that are particualry confusing or awkward?

 

Ease of use and ability customize, easily customize.

SolidWorks (programmers) are damned if they do and damned if they
don't. No matter what changes or enhancements they make to the UI they
are going to piss off slightly more or less than half of their users.

Yep, I like it.

Opinions on UI are like ass holes so here is mine. Leave the UI alone,
I don't want or need to feel like I am playing a video game, work on
other issues.

CAM is for the shop floor, CAD crap in gets you CAM crap out.

All are functional some take more getting used to that others but with
a little use they all come out fine.

Tom

 

Well I 'm not sure you can hang that on Mark he's probably just too

If Biasotti is going to make the effort to create advanced videos then
why do a half-assed job? Biasotti is cutting off his nose to spite his
face when he refuses to make the needed files available. If Biasotti
made the needed files available than others could interactively follow
along instead of falling asleep.

They sure are. Very one sided. Why do you think I get so fucking
pissed off with this bullshit.

"I hope he appreciates the time we took to reply in good faith."

It ain't like I'm waiting for him to say thanks.


I'd be happy with the files he refuses to include with his videos. If
an independent like FX Cad Solutions or SolidProfessor (I have still
not checked out the non-free myigetit stuff ) would just do more
advanced stuff then I wouldn't be so annoyed because I wouldn't care.

I have little or no faith in SolidWorks Corp. doing the right thing
for users.

 

Because you have absolutely NO idea how to use the software. None.

 

I've been working with CATIA for the last few years. I guess all I can add
that the SolidWorks comunity would have an interest in is my opinion that
much of what I see rehashed here ad nauseum was adressed years ago in V5.
Look at the feature tree and how it overlays the graphics area as an
example. Not only is it cool looking, it is extremely useful to have your
work presented in this way so it's a real time saver. You can concentrate on
the job at hand in a clear and organized manner - without real effort - and
that should be the target for any interface technology.

When I was deciding which product to learn, I considered the opportunity
cost of a number of products, the support, robust behavior and the true
costs and benefits of ownership. I had an advantage in that I was not
heavily invested in any one product. I had no need to worry about legacy
data and the related issues. The slate was reasonably clean.

Today, given the constant turmoil surrounding the SW interface and the
tremendous give and take in functionality, I can only imagine, and have
formed an opinion, that there is only one reason to invest in SW. The
installed base. You can always find either a job, or contract work.

As a product, it's buggy even when releases mature and it isn't easy to
scale. You also seem to have to relearn the product on an ongoing basis and,
for myself, I don't appreciate software vendors that feel free to waste my
time. That always grinds my gears.

All of that aside, there are many talented people doing a lot of excellent
work with SolidWorks. There is no denying that and I can't imagine anyone
with a pulse trying to do so. Should DSS ever choose to hook the SolidWorks
product up as a seemless integration to CATIA they would have a real winner.
They did an excellent job with NCL as a CAM engine.

 

Well, I just drove back and it's cooler here in the office than it was up
there. Long day though.
LOL

 

He should make his own videos on something he thinks
he knows something about.
Perhaps drivers-ed ...

 

Perhaps it is expected that you are a legal user or at least
*have the software*. Even a student version.

Back to your video games & rubber undies ..

 

Think he will sell you demos of free clues? Or just tell you about
demos?

 

Well Jon the thing is they are not really tutorials as such they are
more like feature demos.
If you had the sketches he used as a reference would that get you
started?
I am a few releases behind so I cant make the file for you.
Do you have a flat bed scanner to do some sketches that look similar
and get them into SW?
This might be a good exercise in itself for you.
If you are not up to that yet I guess I could do some for you out of
community spirit and as an unseasonable Christmas present
If you really are keen to learn that is...

One sided is their policy.
Yes it is irritating even asinine but SW management have had that odd
outlook on life for quite a while.
A while ago it looked as though we had softened them up to being
reasonably convivial on their forum and then they spat the dummy and
started the user group/ blog squad 'sects'
Part of the control your customers, never admit liability or
responsibility, and hide all activity and problems as industrial
secrets philosophy that exists in corporations.
Mark is basically the only one allowed to come here and he has to be
well behaved you see.
Really its just a token gesture on behalf of the company - sort of a
nod at the door without soiling themselves - but I think Mark still
likes to keep up with whats happening here..I wouldn't be too hard on
him

 

easy to customise

Obviously I dont know you or your shop being on the other side of the
world...
I suppose you have quite a few machines of different brands and SW may
not be your only CAD?
When you say customise are you perhaps trying to minimise the
differences between the UI to make it easy to move from one to the
other? or perhaps the UI as provided just doesnt actually mirror the
real world everyday tasks you need to do?
I ask this because it seems to me SW have a mission in their heads to
be obviously visually different from say SolidEdge or Inventor as a
sale point and yet for someone like yourself this would actually be a
royal pain.
Sort of like deliberately making a car with metric bolts when your
existing and perfectly good spanners are imperial...

BTW I get the impression shop people are treated like a lower class in
the US...is that fair comment?
( not wishing to start a riot ;o) )

 

Ok cliff I'll solicit your opinion on this too seeing as how you
turned up here too..

in the past.
Aerospace, automotive and products I think?
I seem to remember you have posted before showing a good knowledge of
CAD history.
I guess you keep up with recent software.
Have you any comments to share about interfaces and how they are
changing.
I would suppose going back a few years CAD was strictly functional and
today it must look um..tacky?
I remember myself how basic the hardware and software was when I first
started as a civil engineering draughtsman doing roading calcs..small
green screen terminal...Pacman was high tech then...ah the old
days ;o)
So come on cliff chip in...

 

HoffY () wrote in :

Excellent point. I forgot to go off on a rant about how sluggish the SW UI
is (in this thread, anyhow). From a user experience point of view, SW
_feels_ slow. Independent of rebuild time, this contributes significantly
to the perception of SW being slow on all but small assemblies. Frequently,
I can wait for one or several seconds for SW to recover after dragging a
note in a drawing. Bad, naughty, evil UI!

 

No, what I am saying no one can set up a UI exactly the way "I" want
it. Not everyone's situation is the same. Different work requires
different tools and maybe even a different look. Then you have people
with personal tastes, styles and preferences based upon experience.

There is a difference between a "Want" and a "Need", IMO ability to
customize is a NEED not a want.

My way of looking at it, no two people are the same.

I am more concerned with functionality and performance than adding a
new look where there are no improvements in performance or
productivity, that does not interest or appeal to me.

It's not any different here than any other place I am aware of.

Tom

 

I've been working with CATIA for the last few years. I guess all I can add

Why is this so much better than pressing F9 to remove the Feature
Manager and using the fly out Feature Manager in SolidWorks?
SolidWorks has eliminated most of the dialog boxes that CATIA still
has because of it's Property Manager. When was the last time you
really used SolidWorks?

 

This goes beyond your basic run of the mill stupidity. If you hide your
FeatureManager, you can't see the PropertyManager, and there is no
flyout for the PM.

SW users have been asking for detachable FM separated from the PM for a
while now. Many people have asked for the transparent CATIA interface
for the tree.

When was the last time you really used SaladForks?

Daisy.