3D Scanning and Prototyping

I've been tasked with investigating 3D scanning and 3D prototyping for
our division of companies and I am looking for any advice or comments
otherwise on any particular models of rapid prototyping machines or
scanners.

I notice that Zcorp is offering both items, is anyone using their
products? Together? and are there any advantages?

Thanks much,

--Matt Schroeder

 

3D scanning is more for reverse engineering, right? There's a product
called RevWorlds that is intergreted with S/W.

3D Prototyping has several options. Which region are you in?

Matt Lorono
http://sw.fcsuper.com

 

I'm mostly interested in hearing from users who have purchased these
systems, and how they feel about their decisions and what they would
do different, as well as recommendations be it positive or negative.

--Matt Schroeder

 

Let me clarify this;

I would like to hear from anyone about any 3D scanner or any 3D
prototyper they have purchased.

Finding anything from end users that's not on the manufacturer's
website has been difficult.

Thanks.

--Matt Schroeder

 

We have the Dimension SST machine and are pretty happy with it. We wanted
parts that were fairly robust, so we picked an FDM machine, rather than SLA
or Z-Corp's system. Even though the parts are ABS, they are not nearly as
strong as machined or molded ABS, but they are usually strong enough for
what we need. Small details are a problem, so if you want something less
than .06" or .08" in diameter it is going to be very weak and may not work
out. We've also seen that parts get weaker with age. I think this may have
to do with our not rinsing them well enough, so that leftover solution that
dissolves the support structure attacks the ABS. Cleaning the parts is
moderately messy. We do it in a lab environment, not the office, although
the FDM machine itself is quite happy in the office.Unless the part has
small, fragile features with support structure around them, I try to remove
as much support material as I can by hand and it tends to fly all over.
Transferring the pallets and parts from the cleaning tank to the rinsing
tank and then into the drying racks tracks water around and the cleaning
solution is highly alkaline. After you've made enough parts you have to dump
the cleaning solution and put in a new batch which can also be a little
messy if you're not careful.

Now that I've listed all of the bad parts, it sounds pretty painful, but we
wouldn't give it up for love or money, at least not until somebody comes up
with a better system.

We looked into buying a scanner and backed off. They are still pretty
expensive and limited in accuracy (around +/-.002" or more). We can get a
scan done by GKS for around $500, so buying our own didn't make much sense.

Jerry Steiger

 

Thanks Jerry, that's good information.

I'm looking at the dimension as well as Zcorp currently. I was always
under the assumption (wrong) that Zcorp's unit was FDM like
Dimensions. It's powder based, and apparently has more than twice the
Z axis resolution of the Dimension units. That impresses me quite a
lot for two reasons. 1) the surfaces will not have the "caulk gun"
patterns on them and 2) the changes in contour levels should run
smoother I would think. I have yet to compare samples of the Zcorp
unit to the Dimension machines that we had reviewed a long while back.

Thanks again for the information.

Also-- Zcorp sells a scanner, handheld, that apparently will do
resolutions tight enough for part inspection. Something like a few
microns.

I'm still interested in more information if anyone has any more input,
please feel free to reply.

--Matt

 

The Zcorp does much finer detail and is quite fast, but the parts as they
come out of the machine are extremely fragile. You have to infiltrate them
to get much mechanical strength. They have some flexible infiltration
materials, but the stiff ones are very brittle. This is based on parts I saw
at least a year ago, so things might have changed.

As I recall, the earlier version is only good to +/-.004" (100 microns). I
think the newer (and more expensive) one is +/-.0016" (40 microns). That was
good enough for a lot of what we would like to do, but not all, so I didn't
check into it any further.

Jerry Steiger

 

We use several 3d scanners, I would definitely recommend the Minolta
Vivid 9i. The resolution is adequate for the price range ($50,000),
but what sets it apart is it's portability. I travel with the unit
extensively and find it to be quite manageable. Higher resolution
devices tend to be less "portable" and quite a bit more expensive. I
have demo'd similarly priced scanners which are portable, however,
they lack in resolution. Most of the data we collect is for in house
CNC carving, we shop out all or our rapid prototyping. I have had
many parts manufactured with the Zcorp unit, the material is not
fantastic, however, the price is great. The scanners they offer have
small work envelopes which I would find to be limiting. There is no
advantage to using a single manufacturer for both the scanner and the
printer (data is data), and in fact would tend towards a manufacturer
that is focussed on a single product. I would be happy to discuss
furter.

 

I will be doing a 3D scanning on the cheap at SolidWorks world on Mon
at 2:45. If you cant be there investigate www.David-Laserscanner.com
this is one outstaning value for the dollar

Ben
www.SolidMentor.com
p.s. after SWW I will be posting the presentation online in video
format

 

The scanners Zcorp has are quite a bit more expensive compared to say
the unit from Nextengine, but I think deservedly so because they are
handheld and pretty obviously have more resolution...maybe. While I
could see us using a handheld unit more, for everything from reverse
engineering to scanning existing machinery to retrofit machine
guarding etc. the cost of the Zcorp unit I think forces us to look
harder at the Nextengine. Especially since it seems like soon there
might be a revolutionary leap in price versus technology.

Thanks for the information all. I'm certainly interested in hearing
from others as well.

--Matt Schroeder

 

On Jan 15, 8:16 am, wrote:
Most of the data we collect is for in house

Good to know--thanks for the input!

--Matt Schroeder

 

Ben, I will be at SolidWorks World, and I was looking through the
seminars again yesterday and saw that you will be doing Laser scanning
on the cheap.
Unfortunately I can't change my original seminars chosen, but maybe I
can stop in anyway.

What sort of resolution are you getting out of the setup I wonder?

Also, those with 3d scanners that output to STL, I get SolidWorks
telling me that the STL has too many surfaces to import in any other
format of STL than graphical representation, which is useless in
SolidWorks.

Any tips?

--Matt Schroeder

 

Check out Rapidform. www.rapidform.com Their XOR software allows you
to build native parametric Solidworks models from scan data.
Rapidform is directly compaitble with many scanners like our Konica
Minolta VIVID 9i too. http://se.konicaminolta.us/products/3d_scanners/index..html

Jim - Konica Minolta