2004 SP2 is up...

Paul:

I'm just a guy who does contract work in consumer products. I know it
would fit your desire to be oppressed better if I were associated with
a reseller or SW direct, sorry to disappoint. I get paid only when I
succeed, which is why I work so hard at not letting software beat me.
I would think in your line of work that you would know better than to
waste time that doesn't bring in revenue. Why do you think spewing
bile in the newsgroup is less of a waste of productivity than sending
bug reports? If you weren't making more money with SW than you could
with something else, why aren't you using that something else?

Armadillo Hunter

 

This is rich... we're supposed to take this seriously? From someone who
hides behind a handle? Someone who is obviously just holding SW pom-poms?

This won't matter because I'm on your ignore list, but let's get a few
things straight...

1) I own an engineering company. You're welcome to check it out by
following the url indicated in my reply address (I'm not here to advertise).

2) At my office we are all high-end SW experts. Not self proclaimed. We
create high end surfaces, we push sheet metal to its limits, we create
vacuum formed parts that most users don't have the opportunity to envision,
as well as injection molded parts, weldments, etc. etc. We do an insane
amount of work in insanely short periods of time. We are at the top of our
game. I don't ever ask anyone here to acknowledge that. Our clients
already do. I put our expertise against anyone's, especially against app
engineers and SW cheerleaders.

3) I don't come here to "get a reaction" and I don't believe Mike Wilson has
ever been guilty of that. From what I can tell he's one of the most capable
SW users I've ever seen from afar and his posts rarely reach into ranting.
He speaks the truth but typically does it with a cool solution oriented
delivery. Your comments about "Wilson" were the most offensive crap in your
post... and totally off-base. Those comments alone label you an ignorant
shill.

4) No, the users here do not typically blame SW whenever a problem crops up.
In the midst of the small amount of bitching, venting, and chit-chat, there
is an unbelievable amount of real helpful information. High end users can
come here to work out surfacing and sheet metal problems and new users can
come here to feel better that it's not them that's making sketches or
drawings sooo slow. If you'd like verification of this, re-read the posts,
paying attention at what people have tried and gone through before coming
here to begin with. I have a senior engineer that submits a problem report
to our VAR nearly every time we run across a problem that didn't exist in a
prior version and whenever there's something that doesn't seem to have a
logical solution. Our var's engineers always respond and usually end up
submitting a request to SW. Our var has very capable, approachable
engineers and we've developed good relationships with them. You know how
many times they've come back with a legitimate work-around? Less than 25%
of the time. Not because our var is lacking, which I suspect would be the
next finger you point, but because we have driven SW since its introduction
and know how to push it to its limits, before we ask for help. I come here
to vent, to enlighten, to occasionally help or learn, or for any other
purpose I deem necessary. Like it or not.

5) I've said it before, SW is still the best package out there. If there
was a better option I'd probably be posting in a different group. True,
they do suck less. That doesn't mean any of us should take poor performance
or failing features with our shorts down. "If it's that bad, just walk
away" - that's just ridiculous. Postings that try to temper peoples disdain
with a bad version are frustrating. It's one thing to suggest we calm down
and restate our problem but it's another thing entirely to tell us that we
don't live up to your calm expectations of cheering quietly. I'd prefer to
tell you that if you don't agree, you're not driving the software hard
enough but that's not my place. The most frustrating thing of all... I do
continually choose SW over the others because the market itself can't seem
to generate a better option. Isn't that sad? That it's 2003 and they're
are only 2 or 3 real choices to solid modelers for design engineers? I find
that the real problem, more than SW shortcomings.

6) The beta program isn't working because, despite the overwhelming
participation, the software got released with its usual crop of bugs. 2003
is more bloated and slower than 2001+ and now 2004 is more bloated and
slower than 2003. They will release what they want, when they want and no
beta tester is going to change that. SW needs to revamp their priority
list. They are clearly prioritizing marketing ahead of performance. When
features get released that don't work and software is slower than it was
before something is wrong. Many of the problems with 2004 were well
documented within the beta. Sure some things got "fixed" but those things
were likely on the to-do list anyway. Exactly how do you feel the beta
program *is* working - because you were able to see the next version ahead
of GPR? Lastly, I am more qualified to say that the beta isn't working
because I am a paying user and they released another pile of major marketing
trash with minor improvements (shouldn't it be the other way around?).


- Eddy

 

pardon me for saying this Imadildo Hunter, but if we all add you to our

That's not precisely true. You will find that I participated somewhat
in a discussion of the merits of Toolbox. I'm not a fan of that
software, but rather than continuing to use something which I find so
lacking, I made my own library rather than endlessly moaning about it.
Don't complain unless you intend to do something.

Neil, that's a precious observation. You're assuming that the "bitch
and moan" club here has something to say that people could benefit
from. The only people who interest me here are those who can identify
ways of getting things done when there are difficulties, not people
who can only identify software problems and turn them into emotional
subjects. Any moron knows when there's a problem.

Besides, spectating is preferable to wasting my time arguing with
folks like you and the others. You all are small corners off of the
Jon Banquer quilt. Posting nonsense mostly for dramatic effect and
attention.

Don't hold your breath. I don't have any pressing need to prove
myself to you.

Armadillo Hunter

 

thanks for the insults -if this NG activity is well beneath you, feel free
to piss off somewhere else.

 

Mr. "armadillo hunter",

I agree with a great deal of what you say. Many people come here to "vent"
because they feel it is in vogue to do so. I think that maybe they get some
weird kick out of doing so and often have little to contribute to the group.
Their time would be better spent sending in SPRs and often times the problem
is due to their lack of experience. The abundance of these types of rants
detracts from the usefulness of the group and makes it a less welcome place
to visit for users who simply come here for information and to further their
skills.

BUT, Mr. Wilson does not fall into the above category by any means. He is
consistently one of the most skillful and generous contributors to this
forum, one of the best at finding and disseminating workarounds, and one of
the most tolerant of the software's flaws. When he is pushed to the breaking
point, I believe it is for a good reason. That is to say, you've picked the
wrong target for your post.

JJ

 

"Besides, spectating is preferable to wasting my time
arguing with folks like you and the others. You all are
small corners off of the Jon Banquer quilt. Posting
nonsense mostly for dramatic effect and attention."

At least your agenda is now out.... how's it workin for ya ?


ROTFLMFAO.

I post here for one reason and one reason only.... to get
the needed changes made in Solidworks that I know are major
problems such as Solidworks continued inability to work on
non-native imported surface geometry, SolidWorks inability
to easily create surfaces and splines with C2 like many
other systems can, etc.

That this annoys imbeciles like you bothers me in the least.

Perhaps you should consider taking my "quilt" and getting
stuffed. Might hurt less than using your armadildo.

jon

 

Dasypodidae Predator,

Well, I'll say this,.. I'm not oppressed and I make a good living as a
independent designer and I work hard at workaround things (sometimes a
indirect issue relating to SW = bitching).
I hear what you are saying about moaning, whining, bitching and time
wasted but actually it does have it's rewards, and usually I bitch about
regressions or when my models fail. I'm not going to judge why people
need to bitch about stuff, and even the best ng's have these issues.
Overall this ng is above average and fairly productive. The ability of
the reader/writer to filter in/out information regardless of it's
pos/neg intent is what a public ng is and that is not going to ever
change. And yes, even the private SW ng has neg stuff on it but it's
toned down.

But, as you may understand, any idiot who has used 3D software (yes I
use other tools) long enough can simply figure out that time applied to
bug reporting will not get your problem fixed sooner or later. Btw,
I've had spr's said to be fixed which were never fixed and I estimate
the majority of bugs I have submitted will never ever be fixed so,...
that is my reward?
As you probably know, I've been modeling in 3D and using 3D for some 15
years now and IMHO, the rewards for bitching, reporting bugs or not
bitching have their balance of rewards.. the user chooses what suits
their needs. Users with experience or people who are not
experienced... sometimes bitch, to each his own.

This is how I see it,.. when understanding, fairness or communication
reach a threshold of intolerance, the realty is, bitching does have it's
rewards and actually gets things done. Unfortunately, the more this
happens, the little things usually get swept back or spr's are
forgotten. And no, I do not think bitching is the right way to go about
things. I just see it for what it has done and imho, bitching should
not have to exist "IF" the company selling the software addressed the
issues better. It's that simple, balancing that tolerance threshold
(problems) for the relationship (SW Corp and the Users) to survive is
generally (because they get paid) SW Corps responsibility. The users
pay SW Corp for that service.
It's actually funny to me because, I pay SW Corp annually to fixed bugs
and regressions,.. but there is no relationship with SW Corp which says
I have to report bugs or regressions... so I automatically become the
bitch!? That is, all users are bitches!?

Anyhow, I do not trust who you are (prove it) and yes it would be easier
to believe you are associated with SW or a Resellar. I've been ~90%
correct on this assumption (or the user use too work for SW or VAR) so
I do not trust you and I do not trust you see the full scope of the
issues/problems (yeah people bitch and guess what they also post
reports as well = double masochism), otherwise, I think you are trying
to be rational but ultimately naive

Otherwise if your submissive rational is to use that pissed off energy
to better help regardless of the problems, or bend over and take it,...
well that would be fine if I saw the balance to the relationship
(getting screwed) but I don't (I'm getting fucked) so I by helping, I'm
helping too fuel the software companies inability's = dysfunctionality =
bad relationship = problems = bitching.

If a fair relationship between SW Corp and the users existed maybe
things would be different?? I've always felt there should be more
needed to balance the relationship.
Otherwise, keeping things as they are or bending over and taking it and
bitching will remain a constant.... hey, we're conditioned and this is
normal??

Sincerely yours and happy winter solstice. 8^)

...

 

Dear Santa,

For my present,... could you please return the JB person back to
whatever planet (I think it's called planet USHM, where only small job
shops using TI calculators and only Demo software exist?) he came from?

Oh, btw, you've got 4 days so, chop-chop!!

p.s., no milk and cookies if you do not succeed.

... ;^)

 

Sorry, they dont have time. Theyre fixing all 374 of mine first ;oP

By "alternative solutions", do you mean your suggestions that you were
going to try to publicly shame Solidworks by writing articles for an
ezine? Or do you mean the "class action" lawsuit? Or is it your post
about the nurses that suggests that SW is maliciously withholding bug
fixes? Certainly you can't be serious about any of this.

Join the club. You are not being singled out.

I have a hard time believing this. Do you mean paying projects?
Anyone who has a professional reputation to uphold finishes projects
that they start come hell or high water. What did you do, just
explain to your customer that you made a bad choice of software and
wouldnt be able to finish the project until some unspecified time in
the future? Or are you talking about a personal project?

What people are failing to recognize is that success or failure is not
tied to whether Company X fixes bug Z or not. In fact, it has nothing
at all to do with software. Your success is dependent on your
choices. If you choose to use a tool that cant cut it, well, as they
say in the commercial about automated toll booths "that means
something".

To be fair, didn't this technique exploit a backdoor quirk about PW,
where it was kind of a bug in PW that allowed that to happen in the
first place, but you made use of it to do something that shouldnt have
been possible? I know you have made a career of using back doors, but
its hardly documented functionality. They didn't actually give you an
spr for that, did they?

Honestly, what system would you not criticize? Of course they have to
prioritize things. You would probably want this to go to a vote where
your brand of "activism" could compete.

Another problem that people arent talking about is the fact that there
are so many conflicting solutions that individual people want. Some
people don't like the new transparent flyout FM that auto-expands, but
I love it. I don't like the Command Manager, but other people do. In
the same way, for some bugs there are multiple ways to fix it, which
some people would consider worse than the bug itself and others would
find perfect.

The lesson that some people will not learn in their entire life is
that life is neither perfect nor fair. You can waste your whole life
fighting that fact, but in the end you will change nothing. The real
question is how do you make use of this information. If you just go
around feeling conspired against, and acting like a little child that
doesnt get his way, well, youve missed a lot of opportunities. It is
a hard pill to swallow, but there are things that you just cannot
change, and beaureaucracy, corporate or governmental is one of them.

Instead of wasting your energy fighting things that you cannot change,
why not do something productive? Pick your battles more selectively.
You strike me as the Don Quixote type, happier the more hopeless the
cause.

Maybe focus on completing jobs that you start? Or how about talk to
the regional SW direct technical guy in your area? I know you feel
ripped off if there is not some back door for you to exploit, but
honestly, flapping about a lawsuit or trying to get slander published
are pretty distasteful ventures, not to mention unrealistic.

You still work for the VAR, then, it seems.

....

You missed your calling, should have been an abortion activist.

Oh god, spare us. The "amigos" was a pointless exercize of the same
stripe. No benefit - hold it, I think Mark got a t-shirt?

Its genuinely funny that youre trying to foment this image of yourself
as an unappreciated martyr, and SolidWorks as a bunch of conspirators.
Why dont you explain the "big picture" to those of us with less
inventive imaginations? Try to do it without using the words
"Kennedy", "UFO", "Area 51", "Roswell" or "Watergate".

It seems you have a few supporters that dont want to believe that you
are capable of anything distasteful. Although I appreciate some of
the technical stuff you have posted, some of your "commentary" posts
appear to be little short of "rabble-rousing".

Stick to modeling, Mike, youre on surer ground there.

Armadillo Hunter

 

You hide behind a hotmail alias and then call us whiners? Why do you expect
us to take you seriously? Yeah, we get angry and criticize. I need to be
better about complaining to my VAR and turning in SPRs. But it was an angry
posting on this group that got the subscription boycott started, and that
got SW's attention for at least a little while, resulting in slightly better
testing and code. I think we need to get their attention again.

You make a number of valid points. I hope you stick around. But calling Mike
Wilson and Eddy Hicks whiners is patently ridiculous.


Jerry Steiger
Tripod Data Systems

 

Dear Santa,

Thanks for granting my wish early even though I'm not Christian. It's
been fun watching this putz get wasted and blown out over on
alt.machines.cnc

For this kind of special laugh I'm truly grateful. :>)

Keep it up and perhaps I'll convert someday ! ;>)


jon

 

A.H.:

Your sentiments are noble, and possibly correct, but using the same ideas you
write about, it could be argued that your little campaign to clean up the
neighborhood will fail for the same reasons that the habitual complainers
will also fail to change anything at SW corp. You can't change human nature.
You're not going to fix world hunger, shut up Jon Banquer or keep people from
making fools of themselves on usenet.

Also, I'm not clear what advantages there are in accusing specific
individuals.

But good luck anyway.

matt

 

That's your opinion. Like assholes, we all have one.

Ever heard the phrase "physician, heal theyself"? Suggesting someone should
be an abortion activist or calling them Don Quixote doesn't strike you as a
bit of rabble-rousing?

You make some good points, but you're not making many points with the folks
in the newsgroup.

So, what's your name? What's your company name?

Jerry Steiger
Tripod Data Systems

 

Need some more blue's clues, little jonnie?

Pay attention now,..here's a blue's clue for you,..

Santa has nothing to do with Christianity. Although, a lot of
christians luv to exploit Santa and I'm sure some think elves are little
disciplines of jesus? Or, on the flip side, a extreme christian may
think the jews devised a santa marketing scheme to sell more product to
the christians and non-christians because hanukah sales were down?
Or,.. for the real extremist, Santa is actually a dyslectic Satan in
disguise!?

And,.. I'm curious, what wet dream are you talking about re:
alt.machines.cnc??
Dude, resume your chemically balanced med therapy!

Happy solstice, jonnie... hey, btw, Santa is making a special flight to
Planet SUHM, bring your demo disc!!

... (this is too easy,.. make him go away mommie)

 

Try calling it a Hanukkah bush this year. Perhaps with divine intervention
you might finally get lucky... but only if you pay her. ;>)

jon

 

WTF!?.. So,.. god is a hooker!?

What type of bush are you consuming at those pre-Kwanza demo parties!?

...

 

Well, I've said what I dropped in to say. Just a few parting
thoughts. You all are pretty tough when it it comes to doling out the
criticism, but it seems you don't like to take it nearly as well.
Just stop and think about it for a second next time you have the urge
to write a scathing flaming post, and ask yourself who its helping.
Flaming when there is no chance of retaliation or being set straight
is a cowards game. I'm not defending SW company or software, that's
not the issue. I'm questioning a few individuals techniques which
make this place an unpleasant one fairly frequently.

Anyway, I will probably continue to lurk to see if things improve at
all, and if not, I will take my own advice and act instead of
complain. Ill likely wind up using this as a search resource instead
of coming daily to read posts.

So long.

Armadillo Hunter

 

Who has flamed you and given you no chance of retaliation or setting them
straight? I'm confused. You've got every opportunity to talk. We all do.
Remember, public newsgroup.

You came in here, nailed a few of us with BS comments and *extremely*
offensive remarks and some of us called you on it.

Please, go away. Or stay if you prefer. It's a free country in here.

- Eddy

 

I really don't see why this is such a frequently unpleasant place for you
when you only lurk to read/use the resource and no one knows you are
there.... you don't want to post anything yourself- why do you expect this
NG to continuously generate Pulitzer prize content for your edification?
I am sorry mate but you haven't really helped yourself by piping up to be
insulting of others. this group exists for anyone interested in SW whatever
their age, competence and disposition. I wouldn't like to see it become so
pc that no one has any personality or character.
cheers, have a nice xmas
neil

 

by the way how is Berlin at this time of year - you have no university
studies to keep your mind busy now?